Grooming a biter

Question:

I’m sure the professional groomers know best, and if I were you I’d go with their advice. However, I’ll toss in my two cents. I adopted a middle-aged rescue bulldog who woudln’t tolerate ANY grooming. He recognized and snapped at Q tips, Otomax tubes, brushes, etc. Certainly he doesn’t need the upkeep that your breed requires. But he does have ears, toenails and wrinkles that require attention, and feet that need to be wiped when it rains. With infinite patience, LOTS of daily practice and advice from a trainer and behaviorist, I have gotten about 80% improvement. I used a head collar, praise and occasional treats (along with basic obedience training, of course). He’s not perfect and may never be, but he is clean and healthy. He even seems to like ear cleaning now. You MUST consult a professional trainer or behaviorist if there’s any chance of a bite. I’m not qualified to give specific advice. I just wanted to let you know that retraining can help. The time involved is well worth it in the long run. In article > I have (my son has!) a mini schnauzer that is in need of grooming. > I usually do it but am getting tired of being bitten when I try to > groom him.

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Response:

>Apparently the owner of the schnauzer was so tired of being bit, she was >trying to get the vet to give her chemical restraints. Those are far more >severe (and could be life threatening) than a short term physical restraint.

. One thing the owner might look into is rescue remedy, flower essences, etc. — herbal remedies to mellow the dog out.  Usually these need to be given for a few days before a stressful event, but that, combined with training and a muzzle could make the whole process less traumatizing for the dog (and owner).  They don’t sedate the dog but can have amazing benefit in calming him. . kassa

Response:

I’m always on here asking for other people, so here it goes again A friend of mine is thinking about purchasing a puppy from a shelter in a few months. She doesn’t know what breed would be best for her, so what do you guys think? She wants a small – medium size dog. Nothing bigger than a Lab. Low shedding required. Much less than say…a GSD. She previously had a Jack Russell, and likes that sort of temperament. She doesn’t exercise that much, so no dog requiring more than 30 mins a day of *active* exercise. She will be home for three straight months. After that, she’ll be out for about 4 hours a day. Her mum will be home in the day, so the dog won’t be completely alone. She’ll be keeping it primarily inside, but it will spend some time outside. Yard isn’t very large, so exercise will be mainly taking it for walks and to the park. Looks wise – nothing muscular looking like a APBT etc. She’d like a dog that likes to play, but can also rest quietly on her bed etc. Any ideas? Thanks Nat

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – > I’m always on here asking for other people, so here it goes again > A friend of mine is thinking about purchasing a puppy from a shelter > in a few months. She doesn’t know what breed would be best for her, so > what do you guys think? > She wants a small – medium size dog. Nothing bigger than a Lab. > Low shedding required. Much less than say…a GSD. > She previously had a Jack Russell, and likes that sort of temperament. > She doesn’t exercise that much, so no dog requiring more than 30 mins > a day of *active* exercise. > She will be home for three straight months. After that, she’ll be out > for about 4 hours a day. Her mum will be home in the day, so the dog > won’t be completely alone. > She’ll be keeping it primarily inside, but it will spend some time > outside. > Yard isn’t very large, so exercise will be mainly taking it for walks > and to the park. > Looks wise – nothing muscular looking like a APBT etc. > She’d like a dog that likes to play, but can also rest quietly on her > bed etc. > Any ideas?

You’ll get more responses if you start a new thread with your question. It’s kinda buried in the "grooming a biter" thread. Just click on the "new message" button at the top of the browser window. Your friend seems pretty open-minded about breeds. I’m sure she’ll find the perfect match at a shelter. I see lots of great terrier mixes at our local shelter. Other than size, a greyhound might also be a good choice for her. Donna & Phoebe, PWD, BWX, CGC!!! — I think, therefore I am. I think.

Response:

I hate to be a "me too"-er, but this kinda calls for it. If she’s not a fan of the Greyhound’s size but likes the personality, maybe a very petite female Greyhound or a Whippet would work. Sorry about that, couldn’t miss a chance to tote the breed’s praises!

Response:

How about a greyhound? Most greyhounds are about 2 years old when adopted. Adopting a puppy is fine but they are alot of work and most breeds (I’m sure I’ll be corrected if wrong) don’t mature until two years of age.         Some greys can be large but most aren’t bigger than a lab. Their coats are easy care.         Let’s break a big misconception, greyhounds do not need a lot of exercise. A few sprints around your yard or living room and they are ready for another nap. They love stuffed toys. They will pounce on it like a cat and then throw it in the air. I often find my dog’s toy floating in her water bowl.         I encourage you and your friend to spend time with some greyhounds. Please don’t dismiss the idea. You may be pleasently surpised about these neat dogs.                                 Reba

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – >How about a greyhound? Most greyhounds are about 2 years old when >adopted. Adopting a puppy is fine but they are alot of work and most >breeds (I’m sure I’ll be corrected if wrong) don’t mature until two >years of age. >    Some greys can be large but most aren’t bigger than a lab. Their coats >are easy care. >    Let’s break a big misconception, greyhounds do not need a lot of >exercise. A few sprints around your yard or living room and they are >ready for another nap. They love stuffed toys. They will pounce on it >like a cat and then throw it in the air. I often find my dog’s toy >floating in her water bowl. >    I encourage you and your friend to spend time with some greyhounds. >Please don’t dismiss the idea. You may be pleasently surpised about >these neat dogs. >                            Reba

K, I’ll tell her to check that out. I don’t know if there are many around here though (here, being Australia), but we’ll see if there are any at shelter. I actually suggested a greyhound myself Nat

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->How about a greyhound? Most greyhounds are about 2 years old when >adopted. Adopting a puppy is fine but they are alot of work and most >breeds (I’m sure I’ll be corrected if wrong) don’t mature until two >years of age. >       Some greys can be large but most aren’t bigger than a lab. Their coats >are easy care. >       Let’s break a big misconception, greyhounds do not need a lot of >exercise. A few sprints around your yard or living room and they are >ready for another nap. They love stuffed toys. They will pounce on it >like a cat and then throw it in the air. I often find my dog’s toy >floating in her water bowl. >       I encourage you and your friend to spend time with some greyhounds. >Please don’t dismiss the idea. You may be pleasently surpised about >these neat dogs. >                               Reba > K, I’ll tell her to check that out. I don’t know if there are many > around here though (here, being Australia), but we’ll see if there are > any at shelter. I actually suggested a greyhound myself > Nat > WHAT ABOUT IF YOU HAVE A CAT

Response:

I have (my son has!) a mini schnauzer that is in need of grooming. I usually do it but am getting tired of being bitten when I try to groom him. I have called a number of vets office to buy a sedative for the dog but they will not even discuss it.  I cannot really afford to pay for general anesthesia to groom a dog. So, how do you groom a biter? Lyndon —

Response:

> I have (my son has!) a mini schnauzer that is in need of grooming. I > usually do it but am getting tired of being bitten when I try to groom him. > I have called a number of vets office to buy a sedative for the dog > but they will not even discuss it.  I cannot really afford to pay for general > anesthesia to groom a dog. > So, how do you groom a biter?

Either train, muzzle, or sedate. Muzzling is the easiest. — Toni www.irish-wolfhounds.com e-mail Toni [at] irish-wolfhounds [dot] com

Response:

>that’s sick, man… > you can’t tie or muzzle or sedate… if the dog doesn’t like it, than she/he > has a point. > try grooming differently, or just give it up at all…

Apparently the owner of the schnauzer was so tired of being bit, she was trying to get the vet to give her chemical restraints. Those are far more severe (and could be life threatening) than a short term physical restraint. Giving up grooming would end up in a matted mess and then the dog would have to be dangerously put under to be shaved down once a year at a vet and mats can cause major problems. (Do we need the maggot thread again?) The muzzles I use are nylon and loose enough the dog can still open his mouth enough to pant and cause no discomfort. Thankfully seldom in my shop do I need them, although having been bitten to the bone by a great Dane last year doing his nails and while his Dad was holding him, I tend to remember to use muzzles sooner lately. =) . Often grooming problems get worse because it starts a caught 22 situation at home. Dog needs to be brushed and fights it because it is dominant and does not think grooming his legs is legal. The Mom gives up half way done. Instead of grooming more often, people tend to leave go something they all hate, so the dog is tangled the next time and fights it even more because now it hurts. Mom gets bit and stops the groom and the dog wins. Soon the dog has Mom trained not to groom him at all. As far as grooming differently, you have brought up a good point. Sometimes different groom methods and different handling will turn a dog that fights being groomed into accepting it. Often that is the very restraints that seem to appall you, standing on a table and taking away his weapon. =) I have had several dogs that I had to muzzle when I first started grooming them that after a few grooms decided it was OK to let me groom them when they found out they could not win. Every dog is an individual and needs to be treated as such and in this situation it would be best to go to a professional groomer who can find the best and kindest way to deal with the dog. It would also be a good idea to let the groomer keep the dog’s furnishings short for easy care at home.

Response:

that’s sick, man… you can’t tie or muzzle or sedate… if the dog doesn’t like it, than she/he has a point. try grooming differently, or just give it up at all…

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> usually do it but am getting tired of being bitten when I try to groom > him. > I have called a number of vets office to buy a sedative for the dog > but they will not even discuss it.  I cannot really afford to pay for > general > anesthesia to groom a dog. > Very Carefully. =) > Take him to a pro and set up weekly appointments for brush and bath. Warn > them and see how he does. Many who have their Mom’s buffaloed are fine for > me because usually it is dominance not aggression. > At home suggestions: > Is it mainly for the feet like many dogs? Buy a muzzle or tie his mouth shut > for the parts you can reach while he is muzzled. Put him on a grooming table > (or something like the dryer with a rubber bath mat)and use a restraint. > Sometimes getting them off your lap and on a table is all you need. > Laurel

Response:

: that’s sick, man… : you can’t tie or muzzle or sedate… if the dog doesn’t like it, than she/he : has a point. : try grooming differently, or just give it up at all… I don’t know about the breed in question but I do know that for some breeds not grooming is flat out cruel. The hair can become so matted that it pulls on the skin, the skin is unable to "breathe" properly and the result is sores, ulcers, infection, and pain.  For some breeds grooming is a medical necessity. Diane Blackman   Re: Jerry Howe http://www.dog-play.com/jerry.html _  _  _  _  _  _  _  _  _  _  _  _  _  _  _  _  _ Be true to your own principles, and hold to them, else complain not when the world runs contrary.

Response:

>that’s sick, man… >you can’t tie or muzzle or sedate… if the dog doesn’t like it, than she/he >has a point. >try grooming differently, or just give it up at all…

You obviously dont have a clue what grooming is all about….Sometimes there is no other choice than using a muzzle.And in my shop,that consists of a long strip of terri cloth from an old towel.If placed correctly,it is NOT sick it is necessary… Whats the other alternative??Manhandling??Headlocks??Restraining by 3 people?Usually ,that makes an animal more upset than if a muzzle is placed on its snout. Sometimes we all have to go through stuff that we dont like…Same goes for animals.And wearing a muzzle for 5 minutes isn’t going to hurt any dog.But without it,many a groomer would be in the hospital as we speak. Rachel

Response:

> usually do it but am getting tired of being bitten when I try to groom him. > I have called a number of vets office to buy a sedative for the dog > but they will not even discuss it.  I cannot really afford to pay for general > anesthesia to groom a dog.

Very Carefully. =) Take him to a pro and set up weekly appointments for brush and bath. Warn them and see how he does. Many who have their Mom’s buffaloed are fine for me because usually it is dominance not aggression. At home suggestions: Is it mainly for the feet like many dogs? Buy a muzzle or tie his mouth shut for the parts you can reach while he is muzzled. Put him on a grooming table (or something like the dryer with a rubber bath mat)and use a restraint. Sometimes getting them off your lap and on a table is all you need. Laurel

Response:

>I have (my son has!) a mini schnauzer that is in need of grooming. I >usually do it but am getting tired of being bitten when I try to groom him.

Have you ever considered taking the dog to a professional groomer?  As long as you are up front with the problem, many will at least try to work on the dog for you.   The advantages of this approach are: 1.  They know what they are doing.      Professional groomers have the experience to allow them to handle dogs with many temperaments.  It is my experience that dogs that are "home groomed" are harder to do.  This is because of the lack of formal training/experience, and because the "groomer" is often inexperienced/unsure of themselves.  This means that they dog is either pulled, cut,  nicked, razor burned, etc.. or that they simply pick up on the lack of authority in the person working on them. 2.  They have the proper equipment.      Professional groomers have the appropriate equipment to safely restrain and groom your pet.  Much easier than you struggling with him on the floor, table, counter, etc. 3.  And *this* is the biggie….. Most dogs are somewhat insecure at the groomers….they are off their "turf", being handled very matter of factly by "strangers"… just like children, they often respond to these circumstances by acting *much* better than they do at home. >I have called a number of vets office to buy a sedative for the dog >but they will not even discuss it.

This is not a good idea because a partially sedated pet is *more* afraid because they sense the lack of control over their body.   >  I cannot really afford to pay for general >anesthesia to groom a dog.

Not only is this an expensive option, but it isn’t a safe one.  Schnauzers require regular grooming… It would not be healthy to put him under every 2 – 3 months for life. Robin

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